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damn, i’ve never seen a lemmy post hit 1k upvotes before
I’ve got a couple that have made it, but most of mine hover in the 200-500 range
Fuck Oprah and her dumb fucking magazine.
I’m old and late to the neurodivergent thing. It’s been interesting and a little comforting to realize that I’m not as weird and alone as I once thought. I’ve struggled most of my life, not greatly, but still a struggle, to “fit in” with extroverts, because that’s all I’ve seen.Those who are more extrovert are loud and insistent and everywhere it seems, so it’s hard to see the rest of us, sometimes, in spite of apparently making up 30% or likely more of the population.
It would have been nice to come to this understanding when I was a teenager when I was really struggling, but that can’t be changed.
To the extroverts: you’re not superior, you’re just different, the same way introverts are not superior, or inferior, just different. I’d wager that the more introverted among us have made much of what we take for granted possible. We’re the scientists and engineers, and a bit ironically the ones who are more curious and thoughtful about the world.
There was the “you’re an extroverted-introvert” or opposite label also going around for a while, to describe people in the middle.
Best way I heard it described was introverts need quiet time to feel refreshed, while extroverts need social time to recharge. This helps me understand my wife better. I need wind down time, she needs the constant chatter. It is a challenging compromise sometimes 😀
“You get an ostentatious personality! And you get an ostentatious personality!” /s
“Learn how to shut the fuck up for like 30 seconds.”
I hate that our society endlessly rewards people that are highly social, early birds with money. I didn’t grow up with any of that.
Unfortunately you’re up against marketing types, and they don’t know how to be quiet. Every time my company has an all hands regional meeting, the chat window is always full of marketing types profusely congratulating each other in public. It’s painful to watch
During the pandemic, our CEO did a company-wide meeting and told us to reach out to extroverts because they were really suffering. And yeah I get that but can’t the extroverts just reach out to each other and everyone else the hassle? I mean that’s already kind of their schtick.
Same at our company. People had to get therapy because of how horrible everything was and how hard it was to be isolated and work from home.
Meanwhile I had never been happier in my life. No one interrupted my work, I had all communication in writing on slack, and I could take micro breaks and throw a load in the washer or handle some small task during the day and still get hours to spare and money saved due to not having a commute.
I often think that “return to office” was “extroverts want a captive audience and don’t care how miserable they are.”
That, and some people really thrive in an environment where their communication lacks a paper trail because they’re duplicitous assholes.
100%
I remember saying at the time that the lockdown was basically the world flipping from Extrovert World to Introvert World temporarily, and as an introvert who essentially has to live permanently in Extrovert World it was wild to see how quickly and utterly the extroverts fell apart when they had to exist in Introvert World even for a short while. And it wasn’t just like “oh they’re unhappy.” It felt legit dangerous, they were ready to burn it all to the ground.
People were taking flights to podunk US towns just to go to bars because they were all closed in large coastal cities. Crazy.
A lot of them moved permanently. I live in a podunk state and yeah. When we got the vaccine, there was a whole new crop of established people at the bars and they were all assholes.
As an extrovert it’s like a 1:10 ratio
Won’t someone think of the social butterflies!?
The funny thing is, introverts were struggling too I’m sure, they just didn’t tell anyone about it like the extroverts did
Struggling to find an open grocery store in the middle of the night so I could shop with nobody around, sure. (Lots of formerly 24 hour businesses are still closed by 10 now, annoyingly)
Yeah, I miss not having to remember what time the grocery store closes.
24h grocery stores where awesome during covid. I really miss going shopping at 3 at night.
Now I’m back to: hungry? maybe going to sleep will fix it
Being confined to the same house as an extrovert? Yeah, that was struggling.
introverts were struggling too I’m sure
Well, you’d be wrong about that.
You don’t get bonus points for suffering in silence
Lol ok?
Well it’s a false dichotomy, so they weren’t just talking to the introverts.
Oversimplified, yes. But false dichotomy?
Which personality typology system are you basing that under, and what other attitude types does it add over extraversion and introversion?
I’m basing it on my own experience and understanding of reality, no “personality typology systems” involved or needed. Not everything is graphable. People talk about getting social energy from interacting with others vs. getting it from being alone, I feel I get social energy from food and sleep, just like the rest of my energy. I enjoy being alone, I enjoy being with people, sometimes I want to do one over the other, but neither predictably more than the other. I get tired from being awake and active for long periods of time, how many people are or aren’t around me doesn’t change that. Like I don’t even think it’s a spectrum between the two, that’s still forcing an arbitrary dichotomy that I just don’t think truly exists. Ultimately it comes down to prescriptivism vs descriptivism, and the latter is always going to be more “true” than the former. It’s great if other people find the comparison helpful for understanding themselves and true to their own experiences, I simply don’t. And if I don’t, I know there are plenty of others that don’t, because I’m exceedingly average and no one is that unique.
All that you said, is precisely what Jungian Psychology teaches. Like I said, oversimplified, yes. False dichotomy, no.
What you described is known as the intuitive introvert. We don’t have a club. Make your own jacket.
The majority of people see it as an either/or issue and I’m of the belief that usage defines the tool, not the other way around. To me, that’s a false dichotomy. If there are a bunch of other distinct categories people can fall into, extrovert vs introvert is just one set of many possible facets of personality-type interactions to be compared, they’re certainly not the two ends of a binary spectrum. Having read this article on intuitive introversion,, I can confidently say that doesn’t describe me either. If you feel that article isn’t an accurate representation of the archetype, I’d be happy to read something you think is and reconsider. Ultimately though, we might as well skip alI that and you could just read me my horoscope, I’d find it equally useful.
You read. I am not on the clock. I am not here to diagnose you. I do not need to be accurate. I do need to use more examples than just my own on these casual things but I digress.
I did not give you a reading list on purpose. So you wouldn’t read it as a Wikipedia article and would instead read with yourself in mind.
I understand your frustration because it is literally mine. But words matter. Personality as described by the laymen usage of only the main attitudes (as in the meme and your gripe) is akin to use a Mendel square in Biology to map out hereditary traits.
A tool of abstract simplification over a vastly more complicated subject. But not a false dichotomy.
P.S. Your horoscope says that your cornflakes are crossing your piss and are being an asshole.
Well you did try to diagnose me, and I found the diagnosis to be wrong, but that’s irrelevant. Of course I read with myself in mind, that’s how I know it didn’t describe me.
Obviously I’m not saying all of Jungian psychology is a false dichotomy, but the way the majority of society interprets and applies it is. If everyone thinks there are only two options when there are innumerable options, that’s a false dichotomy.
“start masking yourself because you make other people uncomfortable”
It was fine when extroverts expected introverts to exhaust themselves conforming to a society that values you and not them.
But I’m an extrovert and do this too cause there’s way more introverts than extroverts and they all find me overwhelming and/or annoying
Yep! My extrovert experience has been largely trying to find the balance between overwhelming/annoying/“too much” and shutting up entirely in awkward shame. It involves lots of trying to make sure I’m not overly talking over introverts, pressuring them to speak more than they’re comfortable, not carrying my load of the conversation, or accidentally disappearing from it.
Just because I love socializing and need more of it than others doesn’t mean I’m good at it or that I don’t have a similar history of social rejection, especially growing up, to a lot of folks online.
There’s also a fair bit that’s reminiscent of being the designated tall person. I’m able to ask strangers questions without too much difficulty, something some introverts in my life greatly appreciate.
“There’s more introverts than extroverts” hell naw, it’s the opposite. There’s way more extroverts than introverts in the world, unfortunately
Could you be neurodivergent?
We’re on lemmy, what do you think?
we are all neurodivergent on this blessed day
Introversion feels so mainstream now. Anybody remember the “antisocial social club” sweaters? Or all the pop songs about feeling left out at the club/party (Lorde and Charlie XCX have a few of these I think).
I’m pretty sure the internet has a big part to do with it. The introverts loved the internet. You could lurk, find communities around niche interests, post anonymously, etc. And then the internet blew up, and the internet veterans became the cool ones.
Internet veteran, and not even a properly old one I just remember AOL on CDs: nah we aren’t cool, the net is full of normies now.
Wow that name invokes more than I feel it should, especially since it refers to continued Usenet adoption. Eternal September.
I remember explaining to a friend that you don’t have to pay for AOL or Microsoft Online to use the internet. And installing TCPIP into the network, and adding dogpile to a browser for them. Flabbergasted.
Lots of people in here talking about the false dichotomy completely missing the point of the post: Society puts a lot of pressure for people to be extroverted but not the other way around.
Well, somebody could argument that being social is a necessary/desirable skill for individuals of a species that needs communities to survive/thrive
You called it a “skill”, it’s not a skill.
Also, as so many people lie somewhere a long the spectrum, and most in the middle, introversion is clearly a useful " skill" as well, or it would have been selected out of the gene pool long, long ago.
So, what are you trying to say again?
First: I am not attacking you.
Second: many disadvantageous traits that today exist, such as illnesses, exist today despite natural selection. So your dicotomy falls apart.
Third: unlike other “lonely” mammals, humans are known to have evolved in communities: they hunt, defend, and bear offspring in communities (plenty of research work on that). Therefore, social bonds are necessary for survival. Therefore, an individual for which establishing those bonds is comparatively easy, has an advantage.
Fourth: a great deal of the human brain is devoted to communication with other humans. Supporting point three.
Fifth: An obnoxious and loud person that consumes the oxygen of the room is NOT an “extrovert”. That’s is a moron. I am not aware of research done on that, but I have no doubts either.
Sixth: Being able to spend time with yourself and meditate about your actions, your emotions, and what happens around you without the necessity of yapping about it, is a skill that many people so desperately need.
Kudos, my fellow human :)
Imagine a room full of extroverts. This would essentially be a circus without audience.
The extroverts I met usually get along very well
Yeah, we meet up regularly at places like bars where you can mingle and chat with new people. It’s not always easygoing, some of us suck, and disagreement happens, but we’re people. Folks who don’t believe this are welcome to come check it out, there are always introverts there too, some even of their own volition
A lot of people can’t tell the difference between extroverts and covert narcissists
You think extroverts are incapable of observing and listening?
Not always but mostly yes
Its just a horde. Somebody gets lynched within like an hour.
It’s not a disease or character flaw, for fuck’s sake.
Annoyed introverts are not convinced
It definitely is seen as a problem to be fixed
Because it scares the “others.” They don’t want your thoughts quiet in your head. They want them out loud where they can assess and judge you.
That someone is an introvert or extrovert is a false dichotomy, everyone actually occupies the gray area in between and can fall on different places along that spectrum at different points in their life, or even in different situations through a single day.
Also, feeling put-upon by clickbait articles from garbage publications…c’mon
Introvert means our social batteries run out around people. There’s nothing to fix. We don’t get energy from having to navigate social situations like extroverts do.
I didn’t say there’s anything to fix, except maybe people’s perception of themselves as all one way or the other
But people do consistently tend towards one end of that spectrum or the other. I’m several decades into life and no one would have ever considered me extroverted. My brother is the opposite.
